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MGG on ABC Asia Pacific TV on Pak Lah as Prime Minister

Australian Broadcasting Corporation Asia Pacific Edition

Transcript of Episode 17: Malaysian Makeover

Transcript

First Broadcast - August 11, 2004 Episode 17: Malaysian Makeover

In this week's episode of The Editors, panellists Steven Gan, Editor-in-chief of Malaysiakini, veteran journalist MGG Pillai and Bunn Nagara, Associate Editor of The Star newspaper examine change under Malaysian prime minister Abdullah Badawi's leadership. Also this week our regular panellist Pramit Pal Chaudhuri, Foreign Editor of the Hindustan Times and Janet Hunt, Senior Lecturer at Melbourne's RMIT University discuss non-profit Non-Government Organisations. Are they generally a force for good, and to whom are they accountable?

Heather Li: Hello and welcome to The Editors, I'm Heather Li in Singapore. Tonight NGOs, Non-Profit Non Government Organisations. Amid the gravest of human tragedies, NGOs are often a lone voice against government complacency and corruption. But are they always a force for good and to whom are they accountable?

Pramit Pal Chaudhuri, Foreign Editor, Hindustan Times: If you allow an NGO unfettered power they will be corruptible with that power.

Janet Hunt, Senior Lecturer, RMIT University, Melbourne: The overall picture is far better than what he's talking about.

Heather Li: But first to Malaysia where Prime Minister Abdullah Badawi has spent his first nine months in office cutting an image very different from that of his predecessor. Where former prime minister Mahathir Mohammad was often outspoken and an advocate of grand projects, Abdullah Badawi or Pak Lah as he's affectionately called, is more measured, more moderate.

Abdullah Badawi has gained favourable publicity recently for his perceived clampdown against corruption and patronage. Tonight we examine whether Malaysia's makeover is the beginning of a substantial reconstruction, or just papering over the cracks.

Bunn Nagara, Associate Editor, The Star: Well I think the record so far has shown that the new Prime Minister has taken some action against allegedly corrupt individuals.

Steven Gan, Editor-in-Chief, Malaysiakini: I think a lot of that is because due to spin doctoring, he got quite a lot of very good spin-doctors.

MGG Pillai, Journalist/Political Commentator: The idea of corruption here is mixed up with political life in this country.

Heather Li: We'll return to our panel in a moment, but first a look at what the media has been saying about the Malaysian Prime Minister. 'Time Asia' in a story last year titled 'Regime Change', said the "new Prime Minister will face a delicate task of distancing himself from his predecessor without seeming disloyal". This month the 'The Financial Times' in an article headed, 'Malaysia's new leader marching to a different beat', said, "Abdullah Badawi has stamped his authority on Malaysia". It said, "he has embarked on widespread reforms of the inefficient and corruption tainted public sector and state-owned companies". A story published by 'Malaysiakini' referred to "western leaders hailing Malaysia as a model of a peaceful secular Muslim country for other Islamic states to emulate". It attributed this peace and stability to the "raft of draconian anti-democratic legislations the state uses to quash its critics and other political dissenters".

Let's cross to our panelists now in Kuala Lumpur, Steven Gan joins me from the online independent news site, 'Malaysiakini', where he's Editor-in-Chief. He was formerly an editorial writer on 'The Nation' in Bangkok, and before that Special Issues Editor for 'The Sun' in KL. Joining me also is political commentator M.G.G Pillai. M.G.G. is a veteran journalist who pioneered internet journalism in Malaysia. His work continues to be prolific in the independent media. And I have our regular panelist, Bunn Nagara joining me from the 'The Star'. Bunn is the Associate Editor of 'The Star' newspaper in Malaysia. He is also a political analyst and is affiliated with various think tanks in Malaysia, Singapore and Japan.

In nine months Malaysia's Prime Minister Abdullah Badawi has gained a reputation of reformer and campaigner against corruption and contracts for friends. Bunn Nagara is this reputation as a reformer well deserved do you think?

Bunn Nagara, Associate Editor, The Star: Well I think the record so far has shown that the new Prime Minister has taken some action against allegedly corrupt individuals, and to that extent it should be deserved. At the same time I think this has been an ongoing process within government generally so the difference is that it mainly has come in the question of style and presentation mostly.

Steven Gan, Editor-in-Chief, Malaysiakini: I think a lot of that is because of due to spin doctoring, he got quite a lot of very good spin-doctors. But definitely over the first few months he did take a number of actions, arresting a few allegedly corrupt VIPs and all that. However I think we have seen very little action.

Heather Li: M.G.G. Pillai what's your take on what we read about Abdullah Badawi's clamp down on corruption?

MGG Pillai, Journalist/Political Commentator: Nothing has happened so far. Two men have been arrested, a few chaps down the line have been detained, but that's about it. Yes he has made a lot of statements of intent, but so far none of it has translated into concrete action.

Heather Li: Last week Singapore's 'Business Times' published a story entitled, "Stepping out of Dr Mahathir's shadow". The 'Business Times' said, "Abdullah Badawi's anti-corruption drive will continue". It said, "some cases involved are friends of former prime minister Dr Mahathir". Steven Gan, is Abdullah Badawi stepping on important toes and if so, what political risks is he taking?

Steven Gan: I think he will take some risks, he will have to decide on how much risk he will have to take, because I think a lot of people, a lot of the party members and party leaders within the party, within UMNO, will not be too happy about that.

Heather Li: M.G.G. you say he hasn't done much so far but do you see it as the beginning of a sincere drive against corruption?

MGG Pillai: No, not yet, for the simple reason that whatever you might say of Dr Mahathir as the prime minister, Pak Lah has been a member of that team for a good ten years. So he has to break out of that shadow, but even if he breaks out of that shadow he's working with the same team. All that has happened is a change of leaders and change of leaders cannot replace a system that is already not functioning for more than a decade. Because the idea of corruption here is mixed up with political life in this country, and there is nothing that can be done without corruption or money politics coming into play. As long as you can remove that group cause I think it will take more than just Pak Lah to do that.

Heather Li: Singapore's 'Business Times' also referred to Abdullah Badawi, abandoning several mega projects, which it said "were associated with his mercurial predecessor". So would you say that was sound economic thinking Steven Gan?

Steven Gan: Yes I think definitely the government is running out of money, we have been running a budget deficit for six consecutive years, and I think that the government feels that the need for it to rein in that budget deficit. The good old days of spending our money is gone. We have splurged quite a lot of our money that we earned from selling oil.

Heather Li: So M.G.G. do you hold grim economic predictions?

MGG Pillai: I think we are facing a crisis and the crisis will come sooner than we expect. So Pak Lah is accepting the reality but he cannot go the whole hog because this spin has been so intense that we are flooded with money.

Heather Li: Steven Gan do you agree with that?

Steven Gan: I think definitely we are in a bit of trouble, not just in terms of the fact that we have problems in terms of debts and all that. But I think the major problem that we are facing are all the issues that we haven't been able to resolve over the past 20 years or been ignored. For instance in terms of upgrading our education system, in terms of upgrading our human resources and all that. All those issues have been ignored over the past 20 years simply because we were more interested in mega projects.

Heather Li: Bunn do you think Malaysia is heading towards becoming a more liberal society?

Bunn Nagara: Well generally speaking yes, I mean you have this mood for opening up links with various sectors, including NGOs, and also encouraging people to respond generally to the issues of the day. And I think it's a long-term process. But I think the signs are there as a matter of the pace and also the degree, so it comes down to those qualifying factors.

Heather Li: M.G.G. a more liberal society would you agree?

MGG Pillai: No not yet because until you come to terms with the issue of Islam in civil polity we're not going to have a liberal or illiberal society, because everything now is predicated to the dominance of Islam in political life. And as long as that is the case the question of a liberal society as you mean it then, and to a certain extent I mean it, cannot take place.

Heather Li: Well the last election in which Abdullah Badawi's party was so successful was described by some as an example of how radical Islam can be defeated at the ballot box. Would you not agree M.G.G.?

MGG Pillai: No I don't, not in this particular case, because there were so many things that went wrong in the elections. When a sudden upsurge of voters in constituencies where senior PAS leaders were standing, and there was a lot of things that were not quite right in this election, and the government is not prepared to address it. You cannot go to court with it because you don't have the proof. But there is a lot of notional evidence about it. And now you have the UMNO elections, and he needed that, all seats were uncontested, all nominations were uncontested, that's not how elections should be held.

Steven Gan: In fact the Election Commission, their chief immediately after the May 21 election did actually call openly for a royal commission into the Election Commission. However this was brushed aside by Badawi.

Heather Li: The other big issue leftover from the Mahathir era is the jailing of former deputy PM Anwar Ibrahim, many claim on trumped up charges. M.G.G. Pillai can the Prime Minister afford to ignore the Anwar issue in your view?

MGG Pillai: He has to resolve the Anwar issue before he can move on because the Malay community is so drastically divided by how he was humiliated, which Malay rule does not allow. Now that he has been humiliated you have to set it right, and so far there is no attempt to set it right because in the process of his humiliation and how he has been denied his day in court all that has happened is that the Malays quietly rebels at how he is treated.

Heather Li: What are you suggesting the Prime Minister should do? Release him or not?

MGG Pillai: Well I don't think he can you know because they have painted themselves into a corner, and I think he wanted to go for medical treatment, and if he had let the health ministry to decide on it the government could have got away it. But instead the health minister came to parliament to say why he cannot go, the moment you did that the issue of Anwar Ibrahim's treatment for his bad spine caused largely by the former inspector general of police beating him to a pulp became a political issue. Anwar will probably, he's so seriously ill at the moment that he could well, die in prison. But you have created a martyr out of him, and that's not going to look good for the government.

Steven Gan: I think Badawi is in a dilemma to an extent, he would argue that look you know, the judiciary is independent, it will help to make his own decision. However I think what is important is that he should send out a strong and unmistakable message to the judiciary that the government respects the independence of the judiciary, that it will not punish judges who happen to come down with decisions that are against the government's interests. That respected judges will be promoted, will be appointed to hear cases and all that. So I think that he has to do that, and so far he hasn't done it, and I think that message hasn't gone across to the judiciary, especially on this case.

Heather Li: Thank you gentlemen, that was Steven Gan from 'Malaysiakini', political commentator, M.G.G. Pillai, and Bunn Nagara, Associate Editor of 'The Star' newspaper in Malaysia.

[The second half of the discussion of NGOs is omitted here, but the transcript of that is available on the local news section of mggpillai.com]

And that's The Editors for tonight. Please do visit our website at abcasiapacific.com/editors. You can check our program times and take part in our online poll, our question this week is, are NGOs generally forces for good? You can vote anytime and the results are tabulated live. The address again, abcasiapacific.com/editors.

For now I'm Heather Li in Singapore. Goodnight.

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© ABC 2004